How to thrive on a non EHU site .

Good points made David. Did you see my request for making this one a sticky and release the ' How to survive a non EHU site ' from the glue. I feel that this is a much better and positive title. The word survive again brings visions of struggle and strife as you fight to survive- it's like the ' Back to basics ' theme that the club is always pushing! I'm not sure that we can't cover refillables on this thread. Refillables are just one part of thriving on a non EHU site at reasonable cost- funny how some see different interpretations in a thread? And I agree entirely, in fact I have stated many times that many people will not have Safefills or similar because it doesn't suit their style of caravanning or they don't use enough gas. As I said to Tinny, there's no problem with that. If you have an idea mate re the titles or what we can do to improve it, please, feel free to expand your theories. Thanks. 

By the way, Does anyone know where tirril is? Not seen him post for ages

Isn't it interesting how others perceive things differently?  I have never seen Merve's posts as anything but a desire to help others save money IF it suits their needs! Are those people perhaps insecure in their camping?  Good grief - some people need to grow up and make their own choices!  Simply ignore what you don't like? 

I know Merve  has helped me save money AND have the convenience of a cylinder I can fill at MY leisure - not when it has run out and supplies of the right brand are miles away!  Not to mention making it easier by being able to actually see the level of the gas - although I must admit I got that wrong once and hitched up to EHU in a heatwave when I actually had a lot more gas than I had thought!  Bright light confused me but I should have looked at the cylinder at dusk or later with a torch and read it properly! 

Can we have a thread about how to run a caravan/Motorhome 'fridge when there is no mains electric....it would help so many and stop mine from defrosting on every trip?

Start one EJB- I find LPG very effective 

As I am going to claim credit for the title, if nothing else, then I am going to put my point of view. Which will probably upset everyone.

Firstly if you put a post on this thread. That basically says we are always on ehu and have not intention to go off ehu. Please don't post, it is boring irrelevant and basically a form of trolling. By all means start your own thread to that effect.

On the other hand if you post I never been off ehu but I am interested in learning more then post away and hopefully you will get good information from experienced people that will help you make a decision.

So Ok you have an opportunity to spend a weekend in a field at an event. I would like to go. Do I need to buy a safefill bottle, solar panel, 3000W inverter and replace every bulb in the van with LEDS?

The answer from me would be emphatic NO! For a weekend away in the summer you need enough gas let's say a couple of kilos and a battery that isn't knackered. That's it.

If you want to go off grid for longer when it is colder and darker then the situation changes a bit. I would look at changing your lights to leds. Most vans built in the last few years are all led anyway. I have in the past used Ultraleds they have a display of the different size, but you will find most 12v halogen bulbs in your van will be G4, the spotlights MR16 or MR11. In truth I bought most of my bulbs off EBay cheap a chips I never had a promblem, my preference was for warm white btw.
Gas, Alde state in their literature that 6kg of gas should last a British weekend in the winter. At Calorlite prices that's £12 per night added to your site fee at safefill prices it works out at about £3.25 ish much cheaper. But what no one tells you is that no one off grid would use a Calorlite anyway They would use either a13 or 19kg bottle because the price is £28 for 13kg so you are probably saving arround £10 per fill significant but not nearly as much of a saving as a basing it on a small bottle usage So getting a safefill depends on how much you use and where you can fill If you want a larger Calor or whatever, a trip to your local car boot will normally come up with an empty bottle for a couple of quid btw. What the manufacturers don't tell you is that your principal systems heating, hot water and fridge all work better on gas anyway

Solar panel just get one but remember a freestanding one is much more efficient than a roof mounted one so it doesn't need to be as big. I have 150W roof mounted panel becausthe van is in storage so it is more convenient. These have become a commodity so don't spend a fortune on a Truma system for example I'm pretty sure don't make panels again I have sourced panels off EBay

I know that Merve has a powerful inverter system fitted. I prefer it simpler so I have manually propelled tooth brush and broom, don't use the microwave, or a hairdryer off grid and tbh don't miss them. I do charge iPads phones and kindles from12v and watch Tv if we want to

I do hope the diversion in to toast was a joke, because if anyone really does limit where they stay based on the need for a toaster If fan that very sad

My set up for what it's worth is

Hymer 590GL all led lights

Alde Heating

150W SP, Morningstar controller

Safefill bottle

Autochage over regulator

Samsung 22" TV claims to be 14v runs fine from battery

Ruark R1 radio again claims to be 14v

vairious charging lead for phones, tablets etc

150W inverter for charging camera and laptop.

The above is not a recommendation just what we have

EJB, run it on gas (obviously), or is this a trick question?

surely, this is a key ingredient of 'losing the orange umbilical' and why a cheap source of gas can help to make this strategy work?

to accentuate the positives in Merves thread, heres a few.....

cost (gas refils at 25% of bottled gas)

cost (non ehu 'proper' sites around a fiver a night cheaper)

cost (non ehu CL type sites around £15 a night cheaper than an EHU 'proper' site)

cost (can refill at any time, no giving back unused gas to supplier)

flexibility (wider choice of sites/aires available compared to those who need EHU)

flexibility (gas supply maintained across europe with adaptors)

to balance the above, some downsides...

cost (initial outlay of cylinder)

flexibility (reliance on LPG locations....may vary in each area) 

similar pros/cons apply to the necessary 12v side of the 'off gridding' equation.

Thanks to you Pippah. All I am trying to do is pass on good news or useful hints together with others. Merve and flock is a bit of a dig isn't it? I have got a bit of a reputation for being like a dog with a bone but it's meant well. When I did the CT clothing 3 or 4 years ago folk were having a go then- this is no different. I certainly do not want to be seen as someone who is trying to convert everyone to non EHU by evangelical fervour!! Nothing could be further from the truth! Folk can either read the thread and add to it if they are interested or, if not, move on. Why would I join in critical conversation when I wasn't even interested in the subject being discussed? I wouldn't. Many people have found that the information on the various non EHU threads very useful - some changing over to non EHU with the new techs and finding it fantastic. Others couldn't care less and that's great too. But this thread gives them a choice. Kevlon (and others) saw and read the non EHU threads and converted his van and from what I read through email, is very happy he did- he had a choice. Had he not been interested, he wouldn't have contacted me! That's all we are trying to do. Now, here's the rub, I sometimes think that folk who come on here and have a poke at me or non EHU in general suspect that we might have something good and worthwhile but have to justify their position by having a go or finding some reason as to why they won't or can't do non EHU I may be wrong - but some posts are critical while others are genuinely helpful, informative and enlightening.

Thanks Boff. I agree with every word. I wouldn't have a cylinder of 13 or 19 kg standing outside my locker- just personal choice. First I have to carry the damn thing and second, I don't want to look like a traveller. I have done it in the past and before the inception of Safefill. Now I don't have to- yet more choice Safefill have given me. You will see my reply to Pippah mirrors your views on irrelevant and boring posts. Again, we see that even within the non EHU community, folk have different ideas of how to do things and thats heathy- we can and do learn from one another. As you know, I have a roof mounted SP. Simple decision- may van is in storage so I needed one that was fixed and safe and that would keep the batteries charged- it has worked perfectly! I would absolutely support your request for anyone wanting to know more about non EHU to post and ask questions. That is what this forum is all about. We are not all the same thank goodness- some of us are more wealthy than others, some need to look for ways to save money to increase our enjoyment of our vans, some may even find this thread and realise that they can actually afford to go caravanning! That they had been looking at club site prices or EHU CLs and decided they couldn't afford it. Now, perhaps they can. Wouldn't that be good!

Sometimes I come over as being anti safefill.  I am not I use a safefill bottle and it's a great bit of kit.  It is also a relatively expensive initial outlay. I am  just  pointing out that there are several ways of, skinning the particular cat of gas use.

 I think people are frightened of going off ehu.  I have been on sites which have had power cuts the voices of panic amazed me.  I want to make it as easy for people to dip their toes into the water as inexpensively as possible.